i think obama has a slight lead. when you look at the middle class, obama leads 19% among those who stand up -- who think he stands up best for the middle class. 19%. but if you ask middle class people who they favor, it's even. 4 48-48. and if you ask something called middle class families, married with kids, middle class families give romney a 14-point lead. now, that tells you there's a lot of movement inside these categories. and i think generically the president's taken a slight lead but it's still a real horse race. >> the first debate on october 3rd, how often are they game changers with six weeks left in the cycle? >> you know, my experience is not that often. mostly -- they're so well-rehearsed. they play defense and don't like to make bold statements. now something might really come out of this thing. but i don't see it as kennedy/nixon or reagan/carter. but who knows? those are the two exceptions. but i think mitt romney is an underrated debater. he may not be as sophisticated as president obama, but i wat